DeadGoblins.com » Forgotten Realms Campaign » Battle tactics & Skill Challenge Discussion

Battle tactics & Skill Challenge Discussion

Moderators: Ari, Michael Doss.

Page: 1

Author Post
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 361
Location: Scottsdale
In this topic the party can strategize or prepare for battle. Feel free to post opinions about teamwork and possible power combinations.
« Last edit by Ari on Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:44 pm. »
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
User posted image

Alysandra can move to N8 (around the cart and through the townspeople, assuming they count as allies an we can move through their squar). With her encounter or daily power she can mark/divine sanction all the enemies within 3 squares, which is all of them except goblins 2 and 3. If they then attack anyone else, such as townspeople, the'll be at -2 to attack and take 8 radiant damage. Assuming the numbered goblines might be minions that should be very effective. Maybe Zetheryin or Crag can kill off goblin two just do whatever you think is best. Ander could go for goblin 12 at first since that's the nearest one.

By the way, I think we might as well use our dailys and maybe action points, since this seems like an introductory battle, albeit much cooler than a barroom brawl. Just a thought.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2008
Posts: 5084
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Since I can place my spirit within 20 squares, I can put him near any goblins you don't mark to keep them busy.
_______________
Salazar Miller - Human Sorcerer 24 - Scales of War
Azad Halim al'Zahir - Tiefling Battlemind|Paladin 7 - Points of Light
Khavak'aashta - Half-Orc Thief 5 - Eberron
Dwimmerlaik - Revenant Hexblade 2 - Dark Campaign
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
garyh wrote
Since I can place my spirit within 20 squares, I can put him near any goblins you don't mark to keep them busy.


Sounds good. Nice range. I assume you mean that the spirit will keep the goblins busy because it can opp attack? I guess the plan may have to change once the two W goblins and H goblin have acted. I imagine that Alysandra will probably die in this encounter, getting herself majorly surrounded, but if that buys the villagers some time, isn't it worth it and what good-aligned paladins are for? :?
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2008
Posts: 5084
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Yeah, my spirit can do OAs. And I can use my standard action to attack through it, where it is.

You'll be surrounded by minions, and only until the sorcerer goes. :) You'll be fine. And I have plenty of healing.
_______________
Salazar Miller - Human Sorcerer 24 - Scales of War
Azad Halim al'Zahir - Tiefling Battlemind|Paladin 7 - Points of Light
Khavak'aashta - Half-Orc Thief 5 - Eberron
Dwimmerlaik - Revenant Hexblade 2 - Dark Campaign
Administrator
Registered: Jun 2008
Posts: 2639
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Is that Ander at V9?

If so, there's not much he can do other than attack 12. It's very strange not having attacks to take out a bunch of people at once =)
_______________
Hedoni Midartis - Eladrin Wizard, Scales of War
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 3164
If Alys wants to stem the tide at N8, Zeth can grab the other flank at K8. I can mark either W, though if Alys uses her encounter power and hits, that mark will erase any I can put this turn, except 2, who I hope to kill anyway.
_______________
Dungeon Master - The Dark Campaign
Sir Muurak - Mul Cavalier 14, Scales of War
Demuriath - Revenant Assassin 5, Points of Light
Kurvilis - Gnome Mage 4, Eberron
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
There may not be anything left for Alys to stem after Crag's attack. I guess we'll see, but that goblin hexer is probably our biggest threat. If there's an opening I could have Alys charge the hexer. Alternatively, she can try to get near the warriors and use her encounter power that will divine sanction burst 3 from her. I it all depends on who did and didn't survive crag's attack. Does anyone see any way to save the townsperson that's cornered in the bottom left?
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 3164
I can only get at most 1 of the minions around that townsperson. I think he is a goner, since even if I kill one, my mark doesn't have enough range to get the other. I should be able to save the one in the top right, next to 2, though.
_______________
Dungeon Master - The Dark Campaign
Sir Muurak - Mul Cavalier 14, Scales of War
Demuriath - Revenant Assassin 5, Points of Light
Kurvilis - Gnome Mage 4, Eberron
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Sounds good. I may charge past any remaining enemies to get at the hexer, AC 20 should help against opp attacks.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Just thought of a good group tactic to use in conjunction with any enemy that is marked by either Divine Challenge (DC) or Divine Sanction (DS). The text reads that DC and DS marked enemies have -2 to hit anyone other than the paladin. In addition, they will take CHA modifier + 3 (8) damage the first time they "make an attack" before the start of the paladin's next turn.

So, any player character could trigger this damage by intentionally incurring an opportunity attack from an enemy with the DS or DC mark on them. This would work especially well for minions and the ideal player character to trigger these opp attacks would be Ander the rogue because he would have an effective 24 AC against opp attacks from these enemies (16 +6 race/class bonuses +2 due to the marked enemies being at -2 to hit anyone but the paladin). Even so, it's a tactic that the swordmage can also trigger with his AC of 19 (effective 21).

Of course, if an enemy CAN make an opp attack that doesn't mean that it has to. If it doesn't, so much the better because the player character moving past won't risk injury. If the marked minion does attack, it will die.

I thought of this as an alternative strategy when multiple minions have the DC/DS mark and the dungeon master might just choose to have the minions move but not attack for a round to avoid instant death. I assume most enemies will have a battle tactic outlined in the encounter and it's unlikely the enemies always just sit around when marked (when they ought to bash on the paladin at least), but if they do we could try triggering some opp attacks. Of course, they don't have to seize the opportunity, but I hope that won't always happen.

In any case, at the very least DS/DC on multiple enemies (especially minions) will make them lose a round of attacks and at best a bunch of them will die trying to kill anyone other than the paladin.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
« Last edit by Viktor on Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:59 pm. »
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Does anyone know if the damage against an enemy marked with divine challenge/sanction is an immediate interrupt or an immediate reaction, when it attacks someone else (i.e. if it's an interrupt, the damage would occur before the attack is completed, if it's a reaction then the damage occurs after the attack deals damage)?
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 3164
I read "any time it makes an attack" as an immediate interrupt. They have started using the language "any time an enemy hits or misses" for something that takes place as a reaction.
_______________
Dungeon Master - The Dark Campaign
Sir Muurak - Mul Cavalier 14, Scales of War
Demuriath - Revenant Assassin 5, Points of Light
Kurvilis - Gnome Mage 4, Eberron
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Jonathan Berg wrote
I read "any time it makes an attack" as an immediate interrupt. They have started using the language "any time an enemy hits or misses" for something that takes place as a reaction.


That would be cool, especially against minions. Since it was you who answered, it made me think of the swordgmage you're playing. The wording for "Aegis of Shielding" mark is the same as the divine challenge/sanction. So, it wouldn't really make sense for the aegis to prevent damage only after damage was dealt (immediate reaction) as opposed to reducing damage prior to giving the damage (immediate interrupt).

By the way, sorry that I didn't go after the hexer. I thought it was more paladinish to try and save the townsperson. I hope Ari allows the girl to hide under the wagon and get away, even though I missed with the second attack.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
« Last edit by Viktor on Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:06 pm. »
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 3164
Though it says that it is an immediate interrupt to reduce the damage. I think if it were a reaction, it would reduce the damage after the damage was dealt, potentially killing off an ally if it had fewer than 9 HP left?
_______________
Dungeon Master - The Dark Campaign
Sir Muurak - Mul Cavalier 14, Scales of War
Demuriath - Revenant Assassin 5, Points of Light
Kurvilis - Gnome Mage 4, Eberron
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
You're right, it does say in the Aegis text that you can reduce the damage as an immediate interrupt. This reduction occurs prior to any damage being dealt in my opinion.

However, with divine challenge/sanction, it's not written anywhere in the text that the radiant damage dealt is an immediate interrupt. All it says is "...it takes -2 penalty to attack rolls for any attack that doesn't include you as a target. Also, it takes radiant damage...the first time it makes an attack that doesn't include you as a target before the start of your next turn."

Since the type of immediate damage is automatic (not the paladin player's choice, unlike with Aegis of Shielding), but not written as interrupt or reaction, it's ambiguous. I haven't been able to find any clear answer on the web about this, but maybe someone else has.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Is it just my computer, or has the "post reply" button in the barrow king adventure thread disappeared? Has someone accidentally closed the thread or something?
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Jun 2009
Posts: 3164
Seems like it. Can Ari reopen it or does Mike need to?
_______________
Dungeon Master - The Dark Campaign
Sir Muurak - Mul Cavalier 14, Scales of War
Demuriath - Revenant Assassin 5, Points of Light
Kurvilis - Gnome Mage 4, Eberron
Administrator
Registered: Jun 2008
Posts: 2639
Location: Santa Ana, CA
I can see it, but I'm the admin. It's listed as "Open" in my settings, too. Ari, did you do anything different?
_______________
Hedoni Midartis - Eladrin Wizard, Scales of War
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
If you want to Mike, Ander could shift to j11 to flank the goblin with Zeth. He'll take one opp attack from red goblin, but it will be at -2 and it will take 8 radiant damage if it attacks and Ander. Plus, Ander's AC against opp attacks is 22 to begin with, so effectively 24.

The goblin attacking Drak'or is harmless so far due to Zeth's Aegis of Shielding, but I don't know if that lasts indefinitely or just one round.

Or you could ignore my boring suggestions and do something really awesome with whatever encounter and daily powers and the action point you have. ;)
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
Moderator
Registered: Oct 2008
Posts: 7786
Invisible castle is still down. I don't know about the rest of you, but if it doesn't come back up soon, I'm okay with Ari making the die rolls "offline" for our characters without a record. We just need to specify all the rolls for him. If you're okay with that Ari.
_______________
Ravenblade - Dwarf Two-Weapon Ranger, Hammer of Moradin (Scales of War)
« Last edit by Viktor on Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:16 am. »

Page: 1

DeadGoblins.com » Forgotten Realms Campaign » Battle tactics & Skill Challenge Discussion

DeadGoblins.com is powered by UseBB 1 Forum Software